Longlife vs vanlig olje

Har jeg DPF på min bil da? (2005.5 - B7 chassi med 1,9TDI motor, usikker på motorkode).

Tviler ikke at longlife fungerer fint på min bil, men er greit å få forklart hvorfor man skal betale x4 ganger oljeprisen. Oljen på min bil ble skiftet på 60.000km (februar 2009), og jeg fikk beskjed ifra Sortland Auto om at jeg ikke trengte å bytte før på 90.000km, men valgte å ta det nå på 15.000km.

 

Det jeg synes var litt rart, er at ifølge Sortland Auto skal det være 30.000km interval, men FIS sier 15.000km (som var grunnen for at jeg bestilte servicetime nå). Fikk dog beskjed om at bremsevesken ikke var skiftet, og det kan vel være grunnen for at bilen stod på at neste service skulle komme på 75.000?

 

Står bakerst i instruksjonsboka di et sted hva slags olje du kan bruke. se etter spesifikasjons nr på flasken du bruker så er du trygg:) Men som sagt er overhode ikke farlig å kjøre ll på din bil. at fis varsler på 15000 kan enten komme av at tilpassingskanal 45 i instrumentet står på 1 istede for 2 som er ll. dette skjer automatisk om man setter tilbake serviceindicatoren med knappene i instrumentet fremfor bruk av diagnose utstyr. Eller den kan varsle på 15000km om du har et ugunstig kjøremønster for olja selv om den er kodet til ll. Så bare for å oppklare hva ll service intervall er.. det er ikke bastant 2 år og 30000km... det er variabelt utifra hvordan oljen blir belastet og vil varsle fra 1 år eller 15000 eller inntil max 30000km og 2 år. om du har dpf som jeg tviler på , kan du ringe audi og oppgi bil nr og få svar på.

 

Du må uansett bruke en olje som er godkjent for pumpedyse motorer.. og det er ikke en vanlig helsynt olje.

 

Er rimelig mange som er med i diskusjonen her som jobber i vag systemet.. syntes virkelig du skal lytte til de på en så ny bil.. Følg de spesifikasjonene som står i instruksjonsboka så er du 100% trygg.

Er rimelig mange som er med i diskusjonen her som jobber i vag systemet.. syntes virkelig du skal lytte til de på en så ny bil.. Følg de spesifikasjonene som står i instruksjonsboka så er du 100% trygg.

Enig. Skal man beholde garantien på en ny bil/motor så bør man følge de kriterier som er oppgitt iht VAG's servicesystem. Det betyr imidlertid ikke at jeg er enig i at det er det beste for motoren, men som sagt er det MIN mening og det trenger ingen avdre være enig i

Om noen skulle ha interesse av det så er det på nettet mengder av informasjon om hva som har skjedd med motoroljer de siste 10 årene. Har lagt med to artikler.

 

 

 

http://www.memphisbritishcars.org/newsletters/oil200702.htm

OIL IS KILLING OUR CARS!!!!!

 

By: Keith Ansell, Foreign Parts Positively, Inc.

 

About a year ago I read about the reduction of zinc dialkyl dithiophosphate (ZDDP) in the oils supplied with API approval that could affect sliding and high pressure (EP) friction in our cars. The reduction of these chemicals in supplied oils was based on the fact that phosphates reduce the effectiveness and eventually damage catalytic converters and introduce minute amounts of pollutants into our atmosphere.

 

A couple of months ago I had a member of the Columbia Gorge MG Club bring a totally failed camshaft and lifters back to me that had only 900 miles on them!! I immediately contacted the camshaft re-grinder (Delta Cam) and asked how this could happen. They were well aware of this problem as they were starting to have many failures of this type.

 

In the past, the lack of a molybdenum disulfide camshaft assembly lubricant, at assembly, was about the only thing that could create this type of problem. My customer has assembled many engines and had lubricated the camshaft properly. Then the bad news came out: It’s today’s “modern” API (American Petroleum Industry) approved oils that are killing our engines: Meaning all flat tappet (cam follower) equipped engines, as used in all BMC products, all British Leyland products, most pushrod engines prior to 1980, early Volvos, American high-performance engines and many others.

 

Next call: To a major camshaft supplier, both stock and performance (Crane). They now have an additive for whatever oil you are using during break-in so that the camshaft and lifters won’t fail in an unreasonably short period of time. They also suggest using a diesel rated oil on flat tappet engines.

 

Next call: To a racing oil manufacturer that we use for the race cars (Red Line Oil). Their response: “We are well aware of the problem and we still use the correct amounts of those additives in our products”. They continued to tell me they are not producing API approved oils so they don’t have to test and comply. Their oils were NOT the “new, improved and approved” ones that destroy flat tappet engines! “We just build the best lubricants possible”. Sounds stupid, doesn’t it, New-Approved but inferior products, but it seems to be true for our cars.

 

To top this off: Our representative from a major supplier of performance and street engine parts (EPWI) stopped by to “warn us” of the problem of the NEW oils on flat tappet engines. This was a call that the representative was making only because of this problem to warn their engine builders! “The reduction of the zinc, manganese and phosphates are causing very early destruction of cams and followers”. They are recommending that, for now at least, there must be a proper oil additive put in the first oil used on new engines, beyond the liberal use of molydisulfide assembly lube. They have been told that the first oil needs the additive but remain skeptical that the first oil is all that is necessary. Their suggestion: Use diesel rated oils such as Delo or Rotella that are usually available at auto stores and gas stations.

 

This problem is BIG! American Engine Rebuilder's Association (AERA) Bulletin #TB2333 directly addresses this problem. I had a short discussion with their engineer and he agreed with all that I had been finding.

 

Next phone call was to a retired engineer from Clevite, a major bearing and component manufacturer. First surprise was that he restored older British Motor bikes. The second surprise was that he was “VERY” aware of this problem because many of the old bikes had rectangular tappets that couldn’t rotate and are having a very large problem with the new oils. He has written an article for the British Bike community that verify all the “bad news” we have been finding.

 

Comp Cams put out “#225 Tech Bulletin: Flat Tappet Camshafts”. They have both an assembly lube and an oil additive. The telling sentence in the bulletin was “While this additive was originally developed specifically for break-in protection, subsequent testing has proven the durability benefits of its long term use. This special blend of additives promotes proper break-in and protects against premature cam and lifter failure by replacing some of the beneficial ingredients that the oil companies have been required to remove from the “off-the–shelf oil”.

 

Next question: Now what do we do?

 

From the camshaft re-grinders (DeltaCam) “Use oils rated for diesel use”, Delo (Standard Oil product) was named. About the same price as other quality petroleum based oils. They have the ZDDP we need in weights we are familiar with.

 

From one camshaft manufacturer (Crane): “use our additive” for the first 500 miles.

 

From General Motors (Chevrolet): add EOS, their oil fortifier, to your oil, it’s only an 8-ounce can (This problem seems to be something GM has known about for some time!). The additive says for break-in only, some dealers add it to every oil change.

 

From Redline Oil: Use our street formulated synthetics. They have what we need! Early in 2007 they will be supplying a “break-in oil” specifically for our cars.

 

From Castrol: We are beginning to see a pattern emerging on older cars. It may be advantageous to use a non-approved lubricant, such as oils that are Diesel rated, 4 Cycle Motorcycle oils and other specified diesel oils. They will be supplying “new oils” specifically for our cars in early 2007.

 

For you science buffs: ZDDP is a single polar molecule that is attracted to Iron based metals. The one polar end tends to “Stand” the molecule up on the metal surface that it is bonded to by heat and friction. This forms a sacrificial layer to protect the base metals of the cam and tappet from contacting each other. Only at very high pressures on a flat tappet cam is this necessary because the oil is squeezed/wiped from the surface. This high pressure is also present on the gudgeon pin (wrist pin) in diesel engines, therefore the need for ZDDP in all diesel engines.

 

Second part of the equation is Molybdenum disulfide (Moly). The moly bonds to the zinc adding an additional, very slippery, sacrificial layer to the metal. I found out that too much of the moly will create problems; lack of this material reduces the effectiveness of the ZDDP. The percentage, by weight is from .01 to .02%, not much, but necessary according to the chemists.

 

Now there is no denying that there is a problem, lack of ZDDP (Zinc Dialkyl DithioPhosphate) in modern oils kills at least our cams and tappets. There seems to be no known alternative.

 

Our cars are a small percentage of the total market and BIG Corporate, the American Petroleum Institute and possibly government have made decisions that are detrimental to our cars. This problem isn’t going away. The trend today is to lighter weight oils to decrease drag, which increases mileage. Most of these seem to be the “Energy Conservation” oils that we cannot use.

 

Redline oil and others are suggesting a 3,000-mile break-in for new engines! Proper seating of rings with today’s lubricants is taking that long to properly seal. Shifting to synthetics before that time will just burn a lot of oil and not run as well as hoped.

 

The “Energy Conservation“ trend was first led by automakers to increase mileage numbers and secondly because the ZDDP and other chemicals degrade the catalytic converter after extended miles, increasing pollution. Most of us don’t have catalytic converters and the mileage gains are not that significant.

 

Many oil companies may have products that will continue to function well in our cars. Castrol, Redline, Valvoline, Mobil, Shell, Amsoil and others have now commented on my original article and are making suggestions. Some companies are offering short lists of “acceptable” oils, others just one. One company has responded without any substantive information in a two-page “bulletin”. By their account all their oils are superior and applicable. This is typical of many companies.

 

[/b]Some oil manufacturers are pointing to metallurgy, blaming poorly built cams and followers. This may have some validity but the bottom line is that there has been a big increase in failures with products that have been on the market for many years but are now having greatly increased failures. To me the bottom line is, if the lubricants are working there is no contact between surfaces, it shouldn’t matter what the materials used in the products are, within reason.[/b]

 

On “modern” production cars, stay with the manufacturers’ suggestions. For any car produced before about 1990 the owner needs to be aware that the factory suggested lubricant may have changed and may not be applicable. Flat tappet, stock, performance or modified may be affected. MGBs from 1975 to 1980 must choose to sacrifice the cam or the catalytic converter as an example of how difficult the decisions are becoming!

 

Yes, there is more! Castrol does understand our dilemma and is actively looking into what it can do to support our cars. We can soon expect to see products from them with specific application to classic cars. Red Line will be offering a “break-in” oil soon after the first of the year. Shell’s Rotella will be good until about June or July of 2007 with possibly nothing after that date. Delo (Chevron) will also be questionable after the new “CJ-4” standards come in the middle of 2007.

 

Now the important information: Oils that may be correct for our cars today: (As reported by manufacturers by 12-31-06, NOTE: many have changed their recommendations over the last three months!

 

Castrol: Syntec 5W-40, Syntec 20W-50, Grand Prix 4-Stroke Motorcycle oil in 10W-40 and 20W-50, TWS Motorsport 10W-60*, BMW Long Life 5W-30 ( full synthetic, available only at BMW dealerships)

Red Line: 10W-30, 10W-40 (Synthetic oils)

Valvoline: VR-1 20W-50 (Conventional oil)

Amsoil: 20W-50(TRO), 10W-40(AMO), 15W-40(AME) & 20W-50(ARO)

Mobil: Mobil 1 5W-30 and 20W-50 (Synthetic)

Chevron: Delo 400

Shell: Rotella

What we are doing at Foreign Parts Positively has been difficult to determine but with few options left, the following is what we are forced to do. Some of our choices have been based on the manufacturer’s willingness to help and specific reports. This list will change in the next months with Castrol and Red Line adding products just for our cars.

 

Break in: Delo 400 30W (A break-in oil will be available from Redline soon!)

Conventional oil: Valvoline VR-1 20W-50

Synthetic: Red Line 10W-30 in newer engines, 10W-40 on older engines.

Break-in is now 3,000 miles (using Delo 400 30W) before changing to running oil.

Oil change interval:

1 year or 18,000 miles with Red Line synthetic

1 year or 2,500 miles with conventional oil (Valvoline VR-1 20W-50).

Thank you to Castrol, Redline, Christiansen Oil, Valvoline, Mobil, Shell, Standard Oil and Amsoil for input. We’re sure this subject will continue: Please forward any new information on this subject you may encounter.

 

We have received some very interesting material from “Mr Moly” that may be putting molybdenum disulfide (MoS) into this discussion. It seems that ZDDP plus MoS is the best from the oil companies’ opinion but MoS by itself may be beneficial. Some racers swear by it. The literature seems to support “Mr. Moly’s” position.

 

Keith M. Ansell

 

 

 

http://www.zddplus.com/

As part of an effort to reduce vehicle emissions, the U.S. EPA offers vehicle manufacturers "credits" for early implementation as well as penalties for violation of emission reduction standards. The EPA's program called for 100,000-mile catalytic converter life by 2004, 120,000 miles by 2007, and 150,000 miles by 2009. To achieve these goals, automotive manufacturers have pressured their oil suppliers to remove substances from motor oils that would shorten the service life, including the proven EP (extreme pressure) additive ZDDP (zinc dialkyldithiophosphate). Zinc and phosphorus from the ZDDP can be present in small amounts in the exhaust gas of an engine depending on the amount of oil which is consumed in combustion. These elements can coat the catalyst reducing the amount of catalyst exposed to the exhaust gases, ultimately increasing emissions at the tailpipe. As a result of the EPA mandate, the ZDDP level in engine oils has been declining since the mid-1990s, roughly coinciding with the implementation of OBDII.

 

ZDDP has been an important additive to engine oils for over 70 years, and has an excellent track record at protecting the sliding metal-to-metal cam lifter interface. Historically, ZDDP has been added to oils in amounts resulting in approximately 0.15% phosphorus, and 0.18% zinc. ZDDP protects by creating a film on cams and flat lifter contact points in response to the extreme pressure and heat at the contact point. The film of zinc and phosphorus compounds provides a sacrificial wear surface protecting the base metal of the cam and lifter from wear. In the course of normal service, this conversion of ZDDP to zinc and phosphorus compounds depletes the ZDDP level in the oil. Studies show that depending on the specific engine and severity of duty, after 2000-4000 miles of operation, the level of ZDDP can drop below that considered adequate to provide wear protection to the cam and lifters.

 

According to the SAE Tech Bulletin # 770087 [1] , operation of a flat tappet engine without adequate EP additives such as ZDDP quickly leads to lifter foot scuffing and cam lobe wear. Camshafts are typically only surface hardened leaving the core ductile for strength. According to the SAE Bulletin, once cam lobe wear reaches 0.0002, "subsequent wear is usually rapid and catastrophic." Two ten-thousandths of an inch is one fifth the thickness of an average human hair.

 

In order to make engines last in the absence of ZDDP, virtually all IC (internal combustion) engines designed in the last ten years utilize roller lifters. Today, ZDDP has been removed from practically all automotive engine oils, rendering them unsuitable for use with older engines with non-roller lifters.

gjør som meg;)har fra dag en je fækk bil,kjørt på god tracktor olje 5-30 å aldrig hatt motor havari eller noe:)å je bruker motora mine;)samma me s2,n å.hehe!ja je er gal veit de!

http://www.zddplus.com/

 

Men bare en liten tanke:

Hvor mange av dere tror at feks. ferrari f430, california, 458, 599 osv. bruker longlife olje og har skifteintervaller på 30.000km? I så fall, rekk opp handa

Det står mye rart på Internett. Her står det for eksempel om "chemtrails". Siden det står skrevet må det vel være sant da?

 

Morten:

Det er jo snakk om helt andre motorer, bygd for helt andre formål. Dessuten gjør det vel ikke eierne av disse bilene noe om de blir flådd litt ekstra ofte på verkstedet.

Den lange artikkelen til Hermann forteller egentlig bare at gamle motorer ikke tåler moderne tynn olje. Det er riktig. Gamle motorer tåler ikke moderne tynn olje.

 

Gamle motorer hadde store sylindre, kort slaglengde, støtstenger og 2 enorme ventiler. Dette skapte enorme flate-mot-flate-trykk. Som krevde tykk olje. Som oljesystemet var laget for. Bruker man moderne tynn olje her, vil oljefilmen bryte sammen. Da blir kammen rund.

 

Moderne motorer har små sylindre, lang slaglengde, overliggende kammer og 4 små ventiler. Det gir mye mindre flate-mot-flate-trykk. Den lange slaglengden gir høy friksjonshastighet. Det krever tynn olje. Som oljesystemet er laget for. Oljefilmen bryter ikke sammen på tynn olje. Fordi flate-mot-flatetrykket er mye mindre.

 

Bruker du gammeldags tykk olje på moderne motor, går det galt. Olja får problemer med å komme ut til de mest avsidesliggende stedene. Der er det fare for smurningssvikt.

 

Fabrikken har laget oljesystemet for å få det til å fungere optimalt. De har definert kravene til viskositet og kvalitet for å få det til å fungere optimalt. Det beste er å følge fabrikkens anbefalinger. Da holder motoren til bilen ruster opp.

Hvilken Shell olje bør brukes på en 07 A3 2,0 TDI BKD motor? Bilen har rullet ca 64 000 km og har gått på Longlife service til nå. Men tenkte og bytte olje hver 15 000km som en ekstra sikkerhet.

 

I følge shell.no får eg opp: Shell HELIX ULTRA AV-L 5W-30

Ref listen i denne tråden: Om oljen du bruker dekker 507.00-506.01 eller 505.01 sisstnevnte kun om bilen ikke går på longlife, så kan den brukes på BKD. 507.00 og 506.01 er begge bedre oljer enn 505.01 uansett interval man kjører.

Ref listen i denne tråden: Om oljen du bruker dekker 507.00-506.01 eller 505.01 sisstnevnte kun om bilen ikke går på longlife, så kan den brukes på BKD. 507.00 og 506.01 er begge bedre oljer enn 505.01 uansett interval man kjører.

 

Takker , ja skal ha olje med 507.00 spesifikasjon.

 

Men du kan jo fint skifte oljen hver 15.000km og fortsatt ha longlife intervall på vanlig service.

Sparer jo endel kroner på å gjøre det på den måten kontra å skulle levere bilen til service hver 15'

 

Trenger en og kode om noe serivce instilling om en bytter olje ofter en Longlife serivce intervallene, men har Longlife intervall resten av servicen?

Oljen de fleste Audi-verksteder bruker er Castrol, i ditt tilfelle Castrol SLX Longlife 5w-30.

 

Et kjapt spørsmål her, er denne Castrol oljen referert til over her Møller bruk i dag?

 

Eller er det Castrol EDGE Professional Longlife III 5W-30 ?

Ref listen i denne tråden: Om oljen du bruker dekker 507.00-506.01 eller 505.01 sisstnevnte kun om bilen ikke går på longlife, så kan den brukes på BKD. 507.00 og 506.01 er begge bedre oljer enn 505.01 uansett interval man kjører.

 

Kan man bruke 505.01 og kjøre 15tkm intervall ? på en bil som orginalt har longlife uten partikkelfilter